Dulce Warren: 0:00

Your good intentions are a great start, and you need to make sure you understand to the best of your ability What are in those governing documents and what you're held to account for. And once you sign sign up to be on the board, your knowledge deficit is not an excuse in a court of law or towards the city or towards the regulations, and most importantly, towards the owners.

Announcer: 0:27

A regular highlight of the HOA Insights podcast is our Board Heroes feature, where we dedicate one episode each month to celebrate the remarkable efforts of HOA board members. To us a board hero is one of the 2 million elected volunteers who deserve recognition for excelling in a role that often goes unnoticed. Today, we're excited to spotlight one of these exceptional board heroes and share their inspiring story. If you match our definition of a board hero, or know someone who does, please reach out to us our contact details and those of our sponsors are provided in the show notes.

Julie Adamen: 0:57

Hi. I'm Julie Adamen, and this is Common Sense for Common Areas, and with me today is Dulce Warren from Colorado. Dulce, introduce yourself.

Dulce Warren: 1:07

Hi, pleased to meet you. I love your podcast, so it's my honor to be here and share with others. So I'm Dulce, and I've served as a volunteer for my condos HOA board for three years. Our association as a small, 16 unit property in West Metro, Denver, and when I'm not wearing my board member hat, I'm a nurse. I've worked in the field for 25 years, doing all kinds of things, and now I get to work from home, which really helps me understand the needs of the property and see the vendors that come and go. Three words that I would use to describe the job be of being a board member, are responsible, objective, fair. And I also want to throw in a fourth bonus, one, being ethical. This really important to me. I was a Girl Scout, after all. The main story I'd like to tell is how my goal of saying yes to being a board member led to a lot of learning and responsible long term cost savings for my community and fellow owners via risk mitigation.

Julie Adamen: 2:08

Well, that's fantastic. Dulce, you know, before we started recording, we were talking a little bit about how you got on the board. Why don't you tell everyone how that happened?

Dulce Warren: 2:15

Well, I closed on my property in November, and then I went to the first board meeting in January and and was asked to join after that meeting, I was reached out to by the two board members at the time and, and I said, Sure, why not? And, and like a lot of people, I've learned that came at a high cost to my sanity initially, but it's been so worth it, because this is my home. I live here. I'm not a renter, and it's just important to me to make sure it's the community I want to see

Julie Adamen: 2:48

that's a terrific reason to be there. In fact, that's the most altruistic reason you can have as a board member. And I think most board members, in my experience, they really are trying to do the right thing. They may be going about it in a rather strange way, but they really, at, you know, internally, want to do the right thing. Then there's the other crazy people, but that's a small percentage so. And also, we were talking about the about the thing that you really need to do for people, you know, whether it's board members, other board members, homeowners, tenants, is to listen. We'll talk a little bit about that, because here on the common sense podcast, we often talk about the communication techniques that happen between board members and homeowners, and the homeowners can be very difficult because they feel so out of control because they're not in charge. And you are, give everyone a little sense of the listening.

Dulce Warren: 3:40

Yes, I'm in a better position to listen now, since we went into a phase of transition between one management company to another, prior to February, when I began communicating directly with our homeowners through a Google account, I sent up for our association and I Google Voice number prior to that, the only way for me to communicate directly with other owners is if I saw them outside, which was minimal, or during our annual meetings, which is me minimal, because it's an annual meeting. So when it came to a point where we needed to change management companies and I set up those accounts, I really went with the intention of positive change management. Leaned in on some training and skills and experts that I've seen when there's a change coming, and just really being positive and addressing the people, the owners and my neighbors, the way I would want to be addressed. So just real friendly, but direct and with a plan of what they could expect, to the best of my knowledge. Well,

Julie Adamen: 4:47

so that's really good communication is what you're talking about, as well as listening. You're communicating what is appropriate information that they can make their decisions on, or how they view the association. Would you call yourself a politician?

Dulce Warren: 5:00

Them. I think I'm learning to be

Julie Adamen: 5:03

the best board members. Have to be you, our politician. I don't mean that the bad sense. I just mean because people, people, people, everything is people. The hard skills that to be in management is, you know, financials have to get prepared, reserve studies, done, all these regular things that we do. But it's those soft skills that really make the difference between really effective board members and ones that are just kind of scraping along. Now you are a nurse. Can you tell me if that training has helped you?

Dulce Warren: 5:33

Absolutely. I've had the honor and privilege of being in several different types of roles, being, you know, a one to one caregiver in people's homes, doing, you know, long term Home Health Nursing. I've also been a labor and delivery nurse and nurse practitioner in that type of OB setting, and then also having a big team to support during the covid pandemic as an infectious disease nurse. So you can only imagine what people expected needed from me as a partner and as a leader. So I really learned from those experiences that when people are really upset, you really just have to listen and have a goal of a shared goal, in mind of safety. And in this case, for HOAs, the shared goal would be safety, also and and harmony, and, you know, maintaining property values, but really peace. And I've kind of, you know, just the lay of the land for my community, everyone is pretty private. A lot of the owners and renters have been here for, gosh, I know one owner said they've had a rent for 13 years. And so what I've observed is everyone wants the same as me, is kind of peace and privacy. So keeping that in mind, I kept that messaging very focused. I think I'm deviating from the question, but I just try to be really respectful.

Julie Adamen: 6:54

Yeah, no, you were, you actually, you were right there on it. I really want to key in on the word you said was peace, which is so interesting. You don't hear that very much in the HOA management world, whether you're managing as a manager or managing as a board member, because you're all in the administration of the community, you never hear that. You'll hear harmony, but you won't hear peace. And actually, when we first started talking before we recorded, you kind of exude that, but it's just this calm, focused kind of demeanor like, Well, you're a nurse, so when the bombs are going off on either side, you're just right there. Yeah,

Dulce Warren: 7:29

yeah. Thank you for that. And some of that is me infusing my value of wanting to be left alone into the community. No, I'm not

Julie Adamen: 7:37

saying standoffish. I just want peace.

Dulce Warren: 7:39

I do. I do. I wave to people, but really I, you know, my role here is not to be your best friend, that I'm not a dormitory Ra. I don't want to be in people's business. I hear what other friends of mine have told me about their HOAs from people citing them for having something they perceive as tacky on their patio, and that is not me. If it's beautiful to you and it's not trash attracting squirrels, you do whatever you think you want to do. I'm not the you know, visual police here, as far as that goes. So I really just want people to feel like this is their home, because it is and respect that I like my patio chairs, and I hope people don't mind them. In your

Julie Adamen: 8:28

association, you must have normal kind of guidelines or rules and regulations that most associations do, like, you know, you can't have to have flowers in the pots for weeks at a time or something like that. Or do you not? Ours

Dulce Warren: 8:38

aren't that specific. They're pretty old and haven't been updated in a long time. As it pertains to that, we did do a recent amendment to our declarations that has to do with an insurance issue. But other than that, one of our documents is photocopy, scanned in, and they are typed. So

Julie Adamen: 8:59

seen them, yeah, kind of scanned in sideways.

Dulce Warren: 9:02

So there really aren't down to the nitty gritty of of what? Because I know some of it, it's a certain color. They're familiar with some of that, but it really isn't. And so I think it's up to how nitty gritty people want to be,

Julie Adamen: 9:19

yeah. Well, you know, what you're trying not to be is micromanaging, which there's a thing that ticks people off more than trying to micromanage them. On the other end, sometimes there's someone who needs a little micromanagement, because, you know, their cars up on board. Whatever I just said, where you are is that it's relative, relatively affluent. I'm just going to use that word for lack of something else, because you only have 16 units, right? And 16 units in four buildings, and they're long established, so people just seem to have the same kind of Zen, if you will, who live building, which is really great, because usually those folks for now don't need any. Kind of micromanaging until somebody new moves in, maybe, but until that time, things can just kind of work as they work now. Now let me ask you this, have you ever had to deal with a complaint from one owner against another?

Dulce Warren: 10:11

Yes, that's currently happening, and it's understandable, and we have dressed it. It specifically has to do with an area of parking that one specific unit, because it's one of the larger units does have in our in our governing documents, it is very clear that there is a special parking spot for them. And this individual is it's not happy that some of the neighbors park at it, park in it, that being said, these units, this condo association, was established over almost 40 years ago, and there was never anything done that we now have in the works such as stenciling and marking that space. So I don't feel it's fair to suddenly punish people when there's no signage and there's no markings, have

Julie Adamen: 11:02

they been doing it for years?

Dulce Warren: 11:04

Parking in the spots? I think maybe it hasn't been an issue until recently. You know, because there's more visitors to this one owner, they seem to be a matriarch in their family, and I think it's wonderful they have visitors, and it's not every time, because I can see that spot, but it bothers this person, and they do have property rights to it, and also it's not marked. With our new property manager, we we have that as one of our projects in progress, to get it marked, and I let the owner know that, yes, I hear you totally we need that spot open for you, for when your family comes and and, yes, so that's in the works, and they seemed okay with that, so we'll make sure that project gets done. But if it's not marked, I don't think it's fair for strangers to know that it's not visitor Park. I

Julie Adamen: 11:51

think that's really reasonable. And the fact that you are, you actually physically going and talking to people, I'm sure you are, but yeah, not

Dulce Warren: 11:57

for that, not for that

Julie Adamen: 11:59

email,

Dulce Warren: 12:01

uh, we did send out an email just to let people know, and copied it directly from the declarations document that those two specific units that have more space are entitled to more spots. And so I did copy and paste that and then linked or attached the document for reference. But not everyone reads their emails, and we have a plan, and I did put in the enforcement of it in violations, but really, truly, until that's March, which will be done shortly, I am not in the business of punishing people who may not read their emails or share emails with their visitors.

Julie Adamen: 12:40

So in this time of trying to create peace that you like, and I just love that again, I love it, but it's just so unusual that that's somebody's mindset. Is it? So in this time, what is probably the worst thing you've had to deal with so far? If it was the parking issue, you're very like, Lucky.

Dulce Warren: 12:58

It kind of is the parking issue. It is the parking issue, snow removal. There was another owner. I mean, people are pretty copacetic around here because they've lived here for so long. And there's preceding Airbnb and short term rentals. There was already a clause in our governing documents. It says no lease is shorter than six months. So everyone pretty, pretty much is stable. Somebody was pretty upset that during a major snow storm that was unexpected, that dumped a lot, the snow removal vendor didn't come until 3pm and and they had to shovel, and they wanted to be compensated. So, you know, discussion and email with with that individual, and thank them for being a good neighbor that this is shared property and we don't get reimbursed for caring for our own property. And thank you so much again, and it's a big snow storm, but that's that seems to be it. Assessments are always something people complain about, and it's my money too, so I get that, and also inflation and so explaining people all the reasons the assessments had to go up, namely, insurance costs, among other things, and wanting to have a savings so they don't have to fork out $2,000 in the future for something. You know, they seem to go oh and but it's that change management and being able to speak directly to my fellow owners without the other property management company interceding, I think has been very fruitful, because I live here and and then my demeanor, like you said, just being respectful and trying to be reasonable, calm,

Julie Adamen: 14:33

very, very calm.

Unknown: 14:35

I do. I try to

Julie Adamen: 14:36

do everything. I mean, it's you could, well, you couldn't do everything you've done as a nurse, I mean, you just listed a huge thing without having that chill kind of vibe about you, you have to

Jessica McConnell: 14:47

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Julie Adamen: 15:24

Let me ask you, does your association put out a newsletter or an E blast? I don't mean like a written, you know, not like a print newsletter, but e blast or anything.

Dulce Warren: 15:32

I don't think historically, they have and they haven't. Recently, the only thing we would get was kind of an automated email would be from the previous property management company that they would send out to everyone about if it was going to freeze, to leave your pipes, you know, open a little bit, or, I don't know, or delayed trash pickup due to holidays. That's really it. So No, and I'm not sure that that's something that would be received well, or is needed here, I haven't got anyone asking for it. It's really the snow, the parking space and dumpsters being overfilled. Oh, that's a big issue, but we're solving that. And so how are you solving the gap? We're solving that because I can see it right out my window, and

Julie Adamen: 16:17

the stork resident, I

Dulce Warren: 16:19

could see it on my kitchen window so I know when it's full. And I had heard from the previous management company a couple times. They reached out to me and said, Hey, do you want to go to three times, three times a week for trash because you've gotten an overcharge? And I said, Well, how many times has this occurred over the last year? And they said, Two. Well, to me, that doesn't seem like it's a problem because I really didn't see it. And the two times I had seen it was around Christmas time, so kind of expected in one other time, when there are new owners, where I saw they were doing some remodeling that apparently had been going on more than I had noticed, because I didn't always work from home. Yeah, so with our and I just said, if it's happening more often, please tell me, and I wouldn't get a response, which was not uncommon with the previous company. You know, it was frustrating. So with the new company, the the guy we have is just so responsive and and that's all I told him, We wanted someone to communicate. And he thought, That's it. I'm like, Yeah,

Julie Adamen: 17:17

it's really it, yeah, phone call return to be nice. Wouldn't it be Oh, he's he's

Dulce Warren: 17:21

great. Amy looks in the neighborhood, and he lives a small operation. So he said, Hey, I sent you an email with all the pictures of the overages you guys have had, and it's only been when the lid six inches, and that's just not okay. And I'm going to talk to them. So in the short time that we transitioned to the new management company and bookkeeper. This is currently in progress. I just signed the contract for the trash pickup. We went from two times a week to three times a week. Got a loyalty discount, and because we have recycling and they're merging that account, which I guess it wasn't, and changing it to a residential account, we're saving $100 going from two times a week to three times a week. So yay. Yeah.

Julie Adamen: 18:06

And you would have expected your previous company to figure that one out, like they should know that kind of thing if you deal with the same vendors all the

Dulce Warren: 18:13

time, yeah. When I asked, well, how often is this happening? The response from the owner of the company was, you can check it out yourself, if you want, and call the garbage company yourself, on

Julie Adamen: 18:25

behalf of our entire profession. Sorry.

Dulce Warren: 18:28

I just was kind of like, well, our contract with you is ending in two weeks anyway. And I just said, Okay, thank you. Oh, that's

Julie Adamen: 18:36

what. He already knew he was terminated. That's why he had that answer. But it's still highly unprofessional.

Dulce Warren: 18:40

The whole time I've been here, there's a typical answer. And so I thought, Okay, this is just affirming my decision. Oh, and one thing I just wanted to touch on for any board members out there listening is something else in my tool belt, maybe about my calm as I was a high school teacher for five years, and and I ran a CNA program, so I had teenagers, and learned a lot through that experience. And then also I was a professor in a nursing program. And so to be able to listen and be fair and when it's high stakes for a large group of people is something I've done several times, so it's always a challenge, but just leaning in on those experiences has really helped. But it's higher stakes here, because these are people's homes. They're not apartments, and this is their place of solitude. And I really try to respect that to the end, that I want it to be respected for me.

Julie Adamen: 19:36

Yes, you know, we always in our end in the industry, your end or our end of the industry, and the management side of it is that everything is so personal to people, because it is personal you're dealing with their money and their living arrangements, and their living arrangement is typically the largest thing they're going to own in their life, you know, and that's the thing they're counting on appreciating over a period of time. And so to have that kind of action. Attitude is, is one that's really going to help, because it is personal. I know from us absolutely on the management end, especially younger managers, because they just haven't had that life experience yet. I started managing when I was 26 or so, and hard to believe, since I'm only 35 but lo these many years ago, you know, and you just think you know everything. When you're 26 or 32 you just know everything. And then you get to be about 50, you're like, Oh man, I should have handled that differently. But it's kind of funny, because your profession has allowed you to develop this. And when you said you lean into it, I think that's really good advice, because most of the board members have had something professionally that they have done, or maybe they've been a stay at home mom with little kids lean into that too, because often, yeah, it's like dealing, yeah, it is a skill set, and you know, most of the skills that people develop do transfer somewhere into being a board member. So let me ask you another question, and you can tell the board members out there who are listening from one of your own board members. What is the biggest piece of advice you would give to someone considering being on their board? Listen to this podcast. I didn't pay her to say that really

Dulce Warren: 21:15

know that your good intentions are a great start, and you need to make sure you understand to the best of your ability What are in those governing documents and what you're held to account for because you will be and once you sign, sign up to be on the board, your knowledge deficit is not an excuse in a court of Law or towards the city or towards the regulations, and most importantly, towards the owner. So towards

Julie Adamen: 21:45

the owners. Yeah, I was just going to say that because it's difficult for all board members out there. You know, you've got this big thing, thick thing of paper, the bylaws, the CCRS, and then you might have rules and regulations and architectural guidelines and policy manual, blah, blah, blah, all this stuff. It's a lot. It doesn't mean you have to memorize everything, but you should be familiar enough or have someone on the board who can answer to speak to almost anything in those documents. Because there is nothing worse as a board member than being caught flat footed at a meeting when someone asks you, I'm not saying they're being a jerk about it, but they're asking you, well, what says that we have to do X, and then you could, well, that has to do with administration, so it's probably in our bylaws. In fact, let me look it up so this that that general Familiarity is incredibly important, incredibly Yeah, and not that you have

Dulce Warren: 22:37

to memorize it. So I don't want to put that on people, because have things memorized, but humility is key. That's a great question. I'm gonna need to get back to you, because I I'm sure there's something I don't have a memorized. So just being open. There's no need to be a know it all. And, no, you

Julie Adamen: 22:53

don't have to. And in fact, if you try to be the know it all and you're faking it or winging it, I guarantee you someone's gonna catch you up and you're gonna look even worse. I tell the same things drive a large suite of online courses for board members, actually, but as well as for Association managers, and that's one of the things always, if you don't have the answer, just say you don't have the answer. And get to say, I'll get back to you, but you have to get back to them. If you don't, you lose credibility as a manager or as a board member, and as soon as, especially board members, as soon as you lose credibility, I mean, then the homeowners just won't have a lot of respect for you. Yeah, I just

Dulce Warren: 23:31

try to keep that in mind. How would I perceive me? And just not being disrespectful and setting a boundary when needed, but being being direct and kind about it, and explaining why it's important. Because I've had to do that

Julie Adamen: 23:44

too. Yeah. And so for everyone to if someone missed the first part, they'll say as they have 16 units. So if you're living in a 1500 unit complex, it might be you still have to do the same type of things, be respectful, communicate, well, you may not be as personal for that many units. I mean, she could have almost a personal relationship with all the people who live there, or at least knows them on site, probably by name. I live in a 2000 unit Hoa, and there's no way they can know everybody. You'd be surprised. They know a lot, but there's no way they could know everyone. So so these larger associations have a more of a communication strategy that is written, meaning email. Occasionally we still get, you know, hard paper stuff, because we do have a lot of older I'm in a 55 and better community, also known as God's waiting room, but, but it's great here. I really like it. But as the cohorts are getting a little bit younger, so the 80 something start to move out, and I'm in my 60s, so the 60s are, were the young people around, you know? And so we're like, don't send it to me snail mail. I want an email. And so they have really answered that. But no matter what Association you're in communication is absolutely key. Robert and I talk about it all the time, so you'll say we're almost. Done. Our time is almost up, so why don't you give the Board members your last words of wisdom on being a board member? Why to do it and what actually is great about it?

Dulce Warren: 25:09

Because it can't be. I think you should do it because it's your home, and if you care about your home and your piece, because that's important and the harmony of the association, you know your property value. Maybe you don't plan to live there forever, then it really behooves you to be on the board to make that change for positive Living Environment and Community and your city. Just make all of it a better place. On the granular level,

Julie Adamen: 25:34

that's why I would encourage you to do it. Is be part of that change you want to see. But really, it's true, that makes a difference. It does make a difference. I completely agree, you know. And sometimes, if you just clean up your own backyard, things look better. And I mean that the large sense, you know. So if more people had that attitude about their communities, whether it's a city or a small town, I think we'd all be better off. And the next thing is, of course, the better communication and striving for some sort of peace, because you may have noticed that we are living in very polarized times. Yes, I can't even believe what goes on. Yes, so much of the time, and in the industry, people are not becoming board members. And in fact, we're having a very difficult time finding people to be board members, or keeping them on the board for not just more than one term, but to finish a term out, it's become very difficult because of how they get treated as board members.

Dulce Warren: 26:31

Thank you, and I would just add to that, what I learned recently is, if there's no one on the board, then the court takes over the board. And so I would give that information to people who are considering it too. If you, as an owner on your own property, want to make decisions and not have a court make the decisions for you, and as a homeowner, then you should definitely be on the board. I didn't even know that when I joined, but now that I know that I will definitely

Julie Adamen: 27:02

it's basically receivership. It goes in, yeah, receivership.

Unknown: 27:05

Thank you for that term. Yeah, I learned that, oh, oh boy, oh yeah, boy. And yeah,

Dulce Warren: 27:11

there's difficult times, and I've had to set boundaries with a few people. Please don't contact me on my personal number, etc, because I've never given it out. But people can find it. So setting that tone in a respectful way is challenging, but I just think it's important. This is my home, and I want to be in charge of managing it, not some stranger. So that's why I'm on the board, because I have an ethical intent, and I think people see that and

Julie Adamen: 27:39

over obligation and ethical

Dulce Warren: 27:41

obligation. So do it because I think it's the right thing to do if you care about your home and you don't have to do it forever, and you can be the face of HOAs are not terrible.

Julie Adamen: 27:50

Yeah, that's right, because they're not. People always think they are, but they're not. They can be challenging, but I just say it's it's not challenging. It's kind of a it, you'll never be bored. How about that? No, no, never on either end, either end. Well, don't say this has been absolutely delightful to get to know you, and this is it for common sense, for common areas, stay tuned to the podcast. We're everywhere that you can get your podcasts, from YouTube to Spotify and everything in between. So for everyone out there, have a great day and get on your board.

Announcer: 28:25

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